169. When the angelic spirits from that world came into view, they hailed us asking who we were and what we wanted. We said we were travellers who had been brought to their abode, and they had nothing to fear from us. For they were afraid that we were some of those who disturb their ideas of God, faith and suchlike; it was to avoid them they had retreated in that direction towards their world, seeking somewhere they could escape them. Asked what ideas these visitors used to disturb them, they replied the idea of three [Persons], and of a Divinity in God with no human feature, when all the time they know and perceive that God is one and is a man. Then we grasped that those who upset them and whom they avoided, were from our world. This was also evident from the fact that it is those from our world who in the next life travel around as the result of the fondness and pleasure they take in travel, which they acquired in the world. For in other worlds people do not travel like this. Later we learned that they were monks, who had travelled our globe with the purpose of converting the heathen. We therefore told them that they were right to avoid them, since their motive is not teaching, but gaining advantage and taking control. At first, we said, they aim to ensnare people's minds by various means, but they end up by making them into slaves under their orders. Moreover, we said, they were right not to let such people upset their concept of God.

[2] They went on to say that their visitors also confused them by saying that the spirits of that world ought to have faith and believe what their visitors said. Their reply to this was that they did not know the meaning of faith or believing, since they could perceive in themselves that a thing was so. They came from the Lord's celestial kingdom, where interior perception allows everyone to know truths which we call matters of faith. They are enlightened by the Lord, and in this differ from those in the spiritual kingdom. A further sign that the angelic spirits of that world came from the celestial kingdom was the sight of a flame, which is the source of their ideas. For the light in the celestial kingdom is like a flame, but in the spiritual kingdom brilliant white.

Those from the celestial kingdom when speaking about truths never say more than 'yes, yes' or 'no, no'; they never reason about whether a matter is so or not. It is these of whom the Lord says:

Your speech is to be 'yes, yes, no, no'. Anything further is from evil. [Matthew 5:37]

This is why those spirits said they did not know what it was to have faith or believe. They regard this as being as if someone told his companion, who could see houses or trees with his own eyes, that he ought to have faith or believe they were houses or trees, when he can clearly see that they are. That is the nature of those from the Lord's celestial kingdom, and of these angelic spirits. ¹

[3] We told them that there are few in our world endowed with interior perception, because when they are young they learn truths which they do not put into practice. A person has two faculties, called the intellect and the will. Those who only allow truths into their memory and so a little way into the intellect, and not into their life, that is, into the will, being unable to have any enlightenment or inward sight from the Lord, say that things must be believed or one must have faith. They also reason about truths, asking whether they are true or not; in fact, they are unwilling to have them perceived by any inward sight or any kind of enlightenment through the intellect. They say this because truths for them are devoid of light from heaven, and those who see without light from heaven can see falsities as truths and truths as falsities. As a result many people in this world have become so blinded, that, even though a person does not put truths into practice, or live by them, they still say he can be saved by faith alone; as if a person's humanity did not come from and depend on the way he lives, but on knowing such things and believing them without living by them.

[4] Afterwards we talked with them about the Lord, about love directed to Him and towards the neighbour, and about regeneration. We said that loving the Lord means loving the commandments He gives, which is living according to them out of love. ² Love towards the neighbour is wishing and consequently doing good to one's fellow citizen, one's country, one's church and the Lord's kingdom, not selfishly so as to be noticed or to earn merit, but from an affection for good. ³ On regeneration we said that those who are regenerated and put truths at once into practice in their lives, come to be able to perceive them inwardly. But those who first take truths into their memory, and then wish for and do what they demand are those who have faith; for they act from faith, which is then called conscience. The spirits said that they perceived this was so, and hence could see what faith was. I spoke with them by means of spiritual ideas, which allow such matters to be presented and grasped lucidly.

Mga talababa:

2715. Two arcana exist here, the first being that, compared with the good of the celestial man, that of the spiritual man is obscure, the second that this obscurity is brightened by light from the Lord's Divine Human. As regards the first of these - that the good residing with the spiritual man is obscure compared with the celestial man's - this may be seen from what has been stated above in 2708 about the state of the spiritual man in comparison with that of the celestial man. From a comparison of the two states the fact of that obscurity is quite evident. With those who are celestial good itself exists implanted in the will part of their mind, and from there light enters the understanding part. But with those who are spiritual the whole of the will part is corrupted, so that they have no good at all from there, and therefore the Lord implants good in the understanding part of their mind, see 863, 875, 895, 927, 928, 1023, 1043, 1044, 2124, 2256. The will part is, in the main, the part of man's mind that possesses life, whereas the understanding part receives life from the will. Since therefore the will part in the case of the spiritual man is so corrupted as to be nothing but evil, and yet evil is flowing in from there unceasingly and constantly into the understanding part, that is, into his thought, it is clear that the good there is obscure compared with the celestial man's good.

[2] As a consequence those who are spiritual do not have love to the Lord, as those who are celestial do; nor therefore does that humility exist with them which is essential in all worship and by means of which good can flow in from the Lord; for a heart that is haughty is not at all receptive, only one that is humble. Nor do those who are spiritual have love towards the neighbour, as those who are celestial do, because self-love and love of the world are constantly flowing in from the will part of their mind, bringing obscurity into the good that goes with that love towards the neighbour. This may also become clear to one who reflects from the fact that when he helps another he does so for worldly reasons; thus though he may not consciously have it in mind he is nevertheless thinking about what he will get in return either from those he helps or in the next life from the Lord, which being so his good is still defiled with merit-seeking. It may also become clear to him from the fact that when he has done anything good and is able to speak about it to others and so set himself up above others, he is in his element. But those who are celestial love the neighbour more than they love themselves, and do not ever think about repayment or in any way set themselves up above others.

[3] The good residing with those who are spiritual is in addition made obscure by persuasive beliefs that are the product of various assumptions, which likewise have their origin in self-love and love of the world. For the nature of their persuasive beliefs even in matters of faith, see 2682, 2689 (end). This too is a product of the influx of evil from the will part of their mind.

[4] It may in addition become clear that the good residing with the spiritual man is obscure compared with the celestial man's, from the fact that he does not know what truth is, as those who are celestial do, from any perception. Instead he knows what truth is from what he has learned from parents and teachers, and also from the doctrine into which he was born. And when he adds to this anything from himself and from his own thinking, it is for the most part the senses and the illusions of the senses, also the rational and the appearances present within the rational, that predominate, and these make it barely possible for him to acknowledge any pure truth like that acknowledged by those who are celestial. But in spite of this, within things that are seemingly true the Lord implants good, even though these truths are mere illusions or else appearances of truth. But this good is made obscure by such truths, for it derives its specific nature from the truths to which it is joined. It is like the light of the sun falling upon objects. The nature of the objects receiving the light causes the light to be seen within those objects in the form of colours, which are beautiful if the nature of the recipient form and the manner of its receiving are fitting and correspondent, hideous if the nature of the recipient form and the manner of its receiving are not fitting and so not correspondent. In the same way good itself acquires a specific nature from the truth [to which it is joined].

[5] The same arcanum is also evident from the fact that the spiritual man does not know what evil is. He scarcely believes that any other evils exist than actions contrary to the Ten Commandments. Of evils present in affection and thought, which are countless, he has no knowledge nor does he reflect on them or call them evils. All delights whatever that go with evil desires and pleasures he does not regard as other than good; and the actual delights that are part of self-love he both pursues, approves of, and excuses, without knowing that such things have an effect on his spirit and that he becomes altogether such in the next life.

[6] From this it is in a similar way clear that although the whole of the Word deals with scarcely any other matter than the good which goes with love to the Lord and love towards the neighbour, the spiritual man does not know that that good is the sum and substance of faith, nor even what the essential nature of love and charity is. It is also clear that though something which is a matter of faith may be known to him - faith being considered by him to be essential in itself - he nevertheless discusses whether it is true, unless he has been confirmed by much experience of life. Those who are celestial do not discuss the same because they know and have a perception that it is true hence the Lord's statement in Matthew,

Let your words be, Yes, yes; No, no; anything beyond this is from evil. ¹ Matthew 5:37.

For those who are celestial are immersed in the truth itself about which those who are spiritual dispute. Consequently because those who are celestial are immersed in the truth itself, they are able to see from it numberless facets of that truth, and so from light to see so to speak heaven in its entirety. But those who are spiritual, because they dispute whether it is true, cannot - so long as they do so - arrive at the remotest boundary of the light existing with those who are celestial, let alone behold anything from their light.

Mga talababa: