555. Verse 8. And they had hair as the hair of women, signifies that they seem to themselves to be also natural affections of truth. This is evident from the signification of "hair," as being the things of the natural man, and in particular the true knowledges [scientifica] there (of which above, n. 66); and from the signification of "women," as being affections (of which presently). "Hair" signifies the things of the natural man because the "head" signifies the things of the spiritual man, and all things of the natural man invest all things of the spiritual man, as the hair invests the head; the head also corresponds to things spiritual, and the hair to things natural, thence also that is what they signify. It is from this correspondence that angels are seen with beautiful hair, and from the orderly arrangement, grace, and gloss of their locks it may be known how the natural man in them corresponds with the spiritual. Now as "women" signify affections, it can be seen that "they had hair as the hair of women" signifies that they seem to themselves to be natural affections of truth. That this is what is signified is evident also from the series; for "faces as men's faces" signify the appearance as if they were spiritual affections of truth; thence now it follows that "hair as the hair of women" signifies there seeming to be natural affection of truth; it is said immediately, too, of their teeth, that they were "as lion's teeth," and these signify the ultimates of the natural man in respect to knowledge and power. In the prophetic Word the terms "woman," and also "daughter" and "virgin" often occur; but it has heretofore been unknown what they signify. It is very evident that a woman, a daughter, or a virgin is not meant, since where these are mentioned the church is treated of; but what they signify can be seen from the connection of the subjects treated of in the spiritual sense.

[2] That "woman" signifies the church as regards the affection of truth, thus the affection of the truth of the church, can be seen from the following passages in the Word. In Jeremiah:

Wherefore commit ye evil against your souls, to cut off from you man and woman, babe, and suckling, out of Jerusalem? ¹ (Jeremiah 44:7).

In the same:

I will scatter man and woman; I will scatter the old man and the lad; I will scatter the young man and the virgin (Jeremiah 51:22).

In Ezekiel:

Slay to destruction the old man and the young man and the virgin and the infant and the women (Ezekiel 9:6).

In Lamentations:

They ravished the women in Zion, the virgins in the cities of Judah; princes were hanged up by their hand; the faces of elders were not honored (Lamentations 5:11, 12).

In these passages "man and woman," "old man and babe," "youth and virgin," do not mean man, woman, old man, babe, youth, and virgin, but all things of the church; "man and woman" signify truth and its affection, "old man and babe" wisdom and innocence, "youth and virgin" the understanding of truth and the affection for good. That such is the signification is made evident from this that these chapters treat of the church and its desolation in respect to truth and good; therefore these terms signify such things as belong to the church. For the Word is inwardly spiritual, because it is Divine; but if man and woman, old man and babe, youth and virgin meant such persons, the Word would not be spiritual but natural; but it becomes spiritual when "man and woman" mean the church in respect to truth and its affection, "old man and babe" the church in respect to wisdom and innocence, and "young man and virgin" the church in respect to intelligence and its affection. Moreover, man is man because the church is in him, and where the church is, there is heaven. When, therefore, man as "old," "young," an "infant," a "male," also "woman" and "virgin" are mentioned, that with them pertaining to the church that corresponds in age, sex, inclination, affection, intelligence, and wisdom, is meant.

[3] That "woman" signifies the church in respect to the affection of truth, or the affection of the truth of the church, can be seen also from these words in Isaiah:

Then seven women shall take hold of one man in that day, saying, We will eat our own bread, and we will clothe ourselves with our own raiment; only let thy name be called upon us; gather thou up our reproach (Isaiah 4:1).

This treats of the end of the church, when there is no longer any truth, for these words precede:

Thy men shall fall by the sword, and thy strength in the war (Isaiah 3:25);

which signify that the understanding of truth will be destroyed by falsities, so that there will be no more resistance in combats; and it is added:

In that day shall the shoot of Jehovah be for splendor and glory (Isaiah 4:2);

which signifies that truth will spring up anew in the church; for this is said of the Lord's coming. "Seven women shall take hold of one man" signifies that truth will be desired and sought from affection but will not be found; "man" signifying truth, "women" affections or longings for truth, and "seven" holiness. That instruction in genuine truths, and thus spiritual nourishment would not be found, is signified by saying "we will eat our own bread, and we will clothe ourselves with our own raiment;" "bread" signifying instruction and spiritual nourishment, and "raiment" truth clothing good; that truth only can be applied and by application conjoined is signified by "only let thy name be called upon us;" and as all esteem is from the spiritual affection of truth and conjunction therefrom, and otherwise there is no esteem, it is said, "gather thou up or take away our reproach."

[4] In Jeremiah:

Return, O virgin of Israel, return to thy cities. How long wilt thou go about? For Jehovah hath created a new thing in the earth; a woman shall compass a man (Jeremiah 31:21, 22).

This treats of the spiritual captivity in which the church was before the Lord's coming. The church is said to be in spiritual captivity when there is no truth, and yet truth is desired; in such captivity were the Gentiles with whom the church was established. "Return, O virgin of Israel, return to thy cities," signifies that they shall return to the truths of doctrine; "virgin of Israel" being the church, and "her cities" the truths of doctrine. "For Jehovah hath created a new thing in the earth, a woman shall compass a man," signifies that a new church is to be established in which truth will be conjoined to its affection; "to create a new thing in the earth" meaning to establish that new thing; "woman" being the church in respect to the affection of truth, "man" truth, and "to compass" to be conjoined.

[5] In Isaiah:

As a woman forsaken and afflicted in spirit Jehovah hath called thee, and a woman of youth when rejected, said thy God. For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great compassions will I gather thee (Isaiah 54:6, 7).

Here, too, "a woman forsaken and afflicted in spirit" means the church that is not in truths and yet is in the affection or longing for them, "woman" meaning the church, which is said to be "forsaken" when it is not in truths, and to be "afflicted in spirit" when in grief from the affection or longing for truths. "A woman of youth" means the Ancient Church, which was in truths from affection; and "one rejected" means the Jewish church, which was not in truths from any spiritual affection; that the church is to be established by the Lord, and delivered from spiritual captivity, is meant by "for a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great compassions will I gather thee."

[6] In Jeremiah:

Hear the word of Jehovah, O ye women, and let your ear perceive the word of His mouth, that ye may teach your sons ² wailing, and a woman her companion lamentation. For death hath come up through the windows, it hath come into our palaces, to cut off the babe from the street, the young man from the broad ways (Jeremiah 9:20, 21).

It was said to women that they should hear and perceive, because "women" signify the church from the affection and reception of truth; "sons whom the women should teach wailing," and the "companion whom a woman should teach lamentation," signify all who are of the church, "sons" signifying those who are in the truths of the church, "companion" they who are in the good of the church; "wailing and lamentation" signify because of the church vastated in respect to truths and goods; "death hath come up through the windows, it hath come into our palaces" signifies infernal falsity entering into the understanding, and thence into all things of thought and affection, "windows" signifying the understanding, and "palaces" all things of the thought and affection; "to cut off the babe from the street, and the young man from the broad ways," signifies the vastation of nascent truth and of truth born; the "babe in the street" meaning nascent truth, and "the young man in the broad ways" truth born.

[7] In Ezekiel:

Two women, the daughters of one mother, who committed whoredoms in Egypt; they committed whoredoms in their youth; the name of the elder was Oholah, and the name of her sister Oholibah; and they bare sons and daughter. Samaria is Oholah, and Jerusalem Oholibah (Ezekiel 23:2-4).

As "Samaria," the metropolis of the Israelites, signifies in the Word the spiritual church, and "Jerusalem," the metropolis of the Jews, the celestial church, each in respect to doctrine; so these are called "women;" and as these two churches act as one, they are called "daughters of one mother," "mother" also signifying the church, as do "Oholah and Oholibah," that is, "the tent or habitation of God," for this signifies heaven where Divine truth and Divine good are, and so, too, the church, for the church is the Lord's heaven on earth; "their committing whoredom in Egypt in their youth" signifies that they were then in no truths but in falsities, for in Egypt they had not the Word; that was given to them afterwards through Moses and the prophets, and it was thus that the church was instituted among them. "To commit whoredom in Egypt" signifies to falsify truths by knowledges of the natural man, and to falsify truths there means to turn holy things into magic, as the Egyptians did; "the sons and daughters whom they bore" signify the falsities and evils of the church.

[8] In Micah:

Ye draw off the robe from them that pass by securely, returning from war. The women of my people ye drive out from the house of their delights (Micah 2:8, 9).

"To draw off the robe from them that pass by securely, returning from war," signifies to deprive of truths all who are in truths, and who have fought against falsities; "who pass by securely" signifies all who are in truths; "returning from war" those who have been in temptations, and who have fought against falsities. "To drive out the women of my people from the house of their delights" signifies to destroy the affections of truth, and thus the pleasantnesses and felicities of heaven, "the women of my people" meaning the affections of truth, and "house of delights" the pleasantnesses and felicities of heaven, for these are the affections of good and truth.

[9] In Zechariah:

I will gather all nations to Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be captured and the house ³ plundered, and the women shall be ravished (Zechariah 14:2).

"All nations" signify evils and falsities of every kind; "Jerusalem" signifies the church, "city" doctrine, "house" everything holy of the church, "women" the affections of truth, and "their being ravished" that truths will be perverted, and that thus the affections of truth will perish.

[10] In the same:

In that day shall the lamentation in Jerusalem increase, and the land shall lament and every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their women apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their women apart; the family of the house of Levi apart, and their women apart; the family of the house of Simeon apart, and their women apart; all the families that are left, every family apart, and their women apart (Zechariah 12:11-14).

What "David" and his house, likewise what "Levi," and "Simeon," and their houses signify, has been shown in the explanations above, namely, that "David" signifies Divine truth, "Nathan" the doctrine of truth, "Levi" the good of charity, and "Simeon" truth and good in respect to perception and obedience. It is said "the families shall lament apart, and their women apart," because "families" signify the truths of the church, and "women" the affections of truth; and these "lament apart" when truth laments because there is no affection of it, and affection laments because it has no truth. This is said of the lamentation over each and all things of the church because they are vastated and destroyed; for each and all things of the church are signified by "all the families that are left," which mean the tribes. That "the twelve tribes" signify all things of the church in the complex may be seen above (n. 430, 431). "Jerusalem" signifies the church and its doctrine.

[11] In Matthew:

Then shall two be in the field, one shall be taken and the other left. Two shall be grinding at the mill, one shall be taken and the other left (Matthew 24:40, 41).

By the first two are meant men, and women by the last two; and "men" signify those who are in truths, and "women" those who are in good from the affection of truth; here, however, "men" mean those who are in falsities, and "women" those who are in evils from the affection of falsity, for it is said that "one shall be taken and the other shall be left;" meaning that those shall be saved who are in truths from affection, and those shall be condemned who are in evils from affection. "Field" signifies the church; "to grind" signifies to acquire for themselves truths of doctrine from the Word; those who apply these truths to good are signified by those who "shall be taken," and those who apply them to evil are signified by those who "shall be left." (But this may be seen explained in the Arcana Coelestia 4334, 4335.)

[12] In Moses:

I will break for you the staff of bread, that ten women may bake your bread in one oven, and they shall bring back your bread by weight; and ye shall eat and not be satisfied (Leviticus 26:26).

This means, in the spiritual sense, that truth from good, which is spiritual nourishment, shall fail, "bread" signifying all spiritual food by which the man of the church is nourished, and "women" those of the church who are in the affection of truth. "Ten women shall bake bread in one oven" signifies that the truth which may be conjoined to good will be sought for but very little will be found; for "to bake" signifies to prepare and conjoin that it may serve for the use of life; "to bring back the bread by weight" signifies that it is scarce; and "to eat and not be satisfied" signifies because truth from good is so scanty and scarce as to yield hardly any nourishment to the soul.

[13] In Moses:

A man's garment shall not be upon a woman, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment; for whosoever doeth these things is an abomination unto Jehovah thy God (Deuteronomy 22:5).

"Man and his garment" signifies truth, and "woman and her garment" signifies the affection of truth. These in every man are as distinct as understanding and will are, or as thought which is of the understanding, and affection which is of the will are; and unless they were distinct, the sexes would be confounded, and there would be no marriage, for in marriage man is the truth which is of the thought, and woman is affection.

That man and woman were both so created that they may be two and yet one, is evident from the book of Genesis in which it is said of the creation of the two:

And God created man in His own image, in the image of God created He him; ⁴ male and female created He them (Genesis 1:27; 5:2).

[14] And afterwards:

The man said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh; for this she shall be called wife, because she was taken out of man. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife; and they shall be one flesh (Genesis 2:23, 24; Mark 10:6-9).

Man here means the church in general and in particular. The church in particular is the man of the church, or the man in whom the church is. "God created man in His own image" signifies in the image of heaven; for "God," that is, Elohim, in the plural, signifies the Divine proceeding that makes heaven, and the man who is a church is a heaven in the least form, for he corresponds to all things of heaven (See in the work on Heaven and Hell 7-12, 51-58). "Male" signifies here, as above, the truth which is of the understanding, and "female" the good which is of the will; the wife is said to be "bone of man's bones, and flesh of his flesh," to signify that good, which is the wife, is from truth, which is the man, "bone" signifying truth before it is vivified, that is, conjoined to good, such as is the truth of the memory with man; and because all good is formed from truths it is said, "because she was taken out of man." That "the man shall leave his father and mother and shall cleave unto his wife" signifies that truth must be of good, and that thus both must become one good; this is signified by "they shall be one flesh," "flesh" signifying good, and also a human being. But the things here said cannot enter the understanding of man, except with few, unless it is known that the first two chapters of Genesis treat of the new creation, that is, of the regeneration of the men of the church, the first chapter of their regeneration, the second of their intelligence and wisdom; and "male and female," or "man and wife," mean in the spiritual sense the conjunction of truth and good, which is called the heavenly marriage, into which marriage man comes when he is regenerated and becomes a church; and man has been regenerated and has become a church when he is in good and in truths therefrom, which is meant by "the man shall leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife, and they shall be as one flesh." (But a still clearer idea of these things may be had from what is said in The Doctrine of the New Jerusalem, On Good and Truth, n. 11-19; On the Will and Understanding, n. 28-33; On Regeneration, n 173-182; also respecting the good from which are truths, n. 24.)

[15] Because "man and woman" signify the conjunction of truth and good:

When Moses saw that the sons of Israel took to themselves the female captives of the Midianites, their enemies, he said that they should kill every woman that had known man by lying with a male; but that they should keep alive the women that had not known man (Numbers 31:17, 18).

These things were commanded because a "woman not conjoined to a man" signified the church in respect to the affection for truth or for conjunction with truth; but "a woman conjoined to a man of Midian" signified good adulterated; for the Midianites represented, and thence signified, truth that is not truth because it is not from good, thus is falsity. This was why the women who had known man were to be killed, but those who had not known man were to be kept alive. "The women of Midian" signified the defilement of good by falsities, and thus good adulterated and profaned, which is filthy adultery, as is evident from what is related respecting "the whoredom of the sons of Israel with the women of the Midianites" (Numbers 25).

[16] Whoever does not know that "woman" signifies the spiritual affection of truth, also that the evils and falsities that everyone has are in the natural man, and none of them in the spiritual man, cannot know what is signified by the following respecting a woman captive in Moses:

If thou shalt see in captivity a woman beautiful in form of the enemy, and hast a desire unto her for a wife, thou shalt bring her into the midst of thy house; where she shall shave her head and pare her nails; then she shall put away the raiment of her captivity from off her, and shall weep for her father and her mother a month of days, and after that thou shalt go in unto her and know her, and she shall be thy wife (Deuteronomy 21:11-13).

A "woman" signifies the church in respect to the spiritual affection of truth, or the spiritual affection of truth which a man of the church has, but "a woman captive beautiful in form" signifies the religious principles with the Gentiles in whom is a longing or affection for truth; that "she is to be brought into the midst of the house, and there is to shave her head, pare her nails, and afterwards put away the raiment of her captivity" signifies that she should be led into the interior or spiritual things of the church, and by means of them reject the evils and falsities of the natural and sensual man; "the midst of the house" signifies things interior which are spiritual; "the hair of the head which must be shaved" signifies the falsities and evils of the natural man; "the nails which must be pared," signify the falsities and evils of the sensual man; and "the raiment of captivity" signifies the falsity of religion in which one who from affection longs for truth is held as it were captive; all these, therefore, must be rejected because they are in the natural and sensual man, as has been said above; that she shall "weep for her father and her mother a month of days" signifies that the evils and falsities of one's religion must be consigned to oblivion; "after that the man should go in unto her and know her, and she should be his wife," signifies that thus truth, which is the "man," can be conjoined with its affection, which is the "wife." Why this statute was given no one can know unless he knows from the spiritual sense what is signified by "a woman taken captive from the enemy," by "the midst or inmost of the house," by "hair," "nails," and "the raiment of captivity," and unless he knows something about the conjunction of truth and good, for on this conjunction all the precepts in the Word concerning marriages are founded. The church in respect to the affection of truth is signified also by:

The woman encompassed with the sun, and in labor, before whom the dragon stood when she should bring forth a man child; and who afterwards fled into the wilderness (Revelation 12:1, et seq.).

Here the "woman" signifies the church, and the "man child" whom she brought forth, the doctrine of truth, as will be seen in the explanation further on.

[17] As "woman" signifies the church in respect to the affection of truth from good, or the affection of truth from good of the man of the church, so in the contrary sense a "woman" signifies the cupidity of falsity from evil; for most things in the Word have also an opposite signification. A "woman" (and women) signify this in the following passages. In Jeremiah:

Seest thou not what they do in the cities of Judah and in the streets of Jerusalem? The sons gather wood and the fathers kindle the fire and the women knead the dough, to make cakes to the queen of the heavens, and also to pour out libations unto other gods (Jeremiah 7:17, 18)

What this prophecy involves cannot be known unless it is known what "the cities of Judah," "the streets of Jerusalem," what the "sons," "fathers," and "women" signify, also what "gathering wood," "kindling a fire," "kneading the dough," "cakes," "the queen of the heavens," and "libations" signify. But when it is known what these signify, and the signification is taken in place of the things named, there results therefrom the spiritual meaning that is involved in this prophecy. "The cities of Judah" signify the doctrinals of the church; "the streets of Jerusalem" the truths of these, but here falsities; "sons" mean those who are in the truths of doctrine, but here those who are in falsities, who are said "to gather wood" when they acquire for themselves falsities from evils; "fathers" mean those who are in the goods of the church, but here those who are in evils, who are said "to kindle a fire" when from the love of evil they favor and excite evils; "women" mean the affections of truth from good, but here the cupidities of falsity from evil; these are said "to knead the dough" when from falsities and according to them they frame doctrine; "to make cakes to the queen of the heavens" signifies to worship infernal evils of every kind, "to make cakes" meaning to worship from evils, and "the queen of the heavens" meaning all evils in the complex, for "the queen of the heavens" has a similar signification as "the host of the heavens;" "to pour out libations unto other gods" signifies to worship from falsities, "other gods" meaning infernal falsities; for "God" signifies, in a good sense, Divine truth proceeding, but "other gods" signify infernal falsities, which are falsities from evil.

[18] In Isaiah:

As for My people, babes are their oppressors, and women rule over it. ⁵ O My people, thy leaders cause thee to err, and have blotted out the way of thy paths (Isaiah 3:12).

"Oppressors," "babes," and "women," signify those who violate, are ignorant of, and pervert truths, "oppressors" meaning those who violate truths; "babes" those who are ignorant of them, and "women" the cupidities that pervert them; "leaders that cause thee to err" signify those who teach; "to blot out the way of thy paths" signifies that the truth which leads is not known.

[19] In the same:

When the harvest withereth, breaking in pieces, the women coming shall set it on fire; for this is a people of no intelligence (Isaiah 27:11).

This is said of the church vastated; "the harvest withering" signifies the truths of good destroyed by evil loves; "the women who set it on fire" signify the cupidities of falsity which altogether consume.

[20] In the same:

Rise up, ye women that are at ease, hear my voice; ye confident sons ⁶ give ear to my speech; the vintage shall be consumed, the ingathering shall not come (Isaiah 32:9, 10).

"Women that are at ease" signify the cupidities of those who are wholly unconcerned about the vastation of the church; "the confident sons" signify the falsities of those who trust in self-intelligence; "women and sons" signify all in the church who are such, whether men or women; "the vintage that shall be consumed, and the ingathering that shall not come" signify that there shall no longer be any truth of the church, for "vintage" has a similar signification as "wine," namely, the truth of the church; and this makes evident what is signified by its "ingathering."

[21] In Ezekiel:

But if a man be just, and hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, neither hath defiled the wife of his companion, neither come near to a menstruous woman (Ezekiel 18:5, 6).

"The just man" is described as one "who hath not eaten upon the mountains," which signifies whose worship is not from infernal loves, for this is the signification of "sacrificing upon mountains," and "eating of the sacrifices;" "who hath not lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel" signifies whose worship is not from the falsities of doctrine, for "idols" signify the falsities of doctrine, and "the house of Israel" means the perverted church in which such falsities are; "who hath not defiled the wife of his companion" signifies who does not adulterate the good of the church and of the Word; "who cometh not near to a menstruous woman" signifies who does not defile truths by the cupidities of falsity.

[22] In Lamentations:

The hands of the compassionate women have sodden their own children that they might become food for them, in the breach of the daughter of My people (Lamentations 4:10).

This signifies the destruction by falsities of the truth and good of doctrine from the Word, and the appropriation of the falsities, with the consequent vastation of the church. "The compassionate women" signify the affections of falsity as if it were truth; "their having sodden children" signifies to destroy by falsities the truths and goods of doctrine from the Word; "to become food for them" signifies to appropriate falsities; and "the breach of the daughter of my people" signifies the vastation of the church. "Women" signify also evil cupidities in Revelation (Revelation 14:4; 17:3, of which in the explanation further on).

Poznámky pod čarou:

462. The fourth experience ¹

In the spiritual world I looked towards the sea-coast and saw a splendid port. On approaching I looked inside and there lay boats both great and small, containing cargoes of every kind; and on their thwarts sat boys and girls who distributed the goods to any that wished. 'We are waiting,' they said, 'for our lovely turtles to appear. They will come out of the sea to us at any moment.'

Then I saw turtles, both small and great, on whose shells and scales sat baby turtles, all looking towards the surrounding islands. The father turtles had two heads, a large one covered with shell like that of their bodies, which gave them a ruddy look; the other a small one of the sort turtles have, which they could draw back into the forepart of their bodies, and could make invisible by inserting it into the larger head. But I kept my gaze on the large, ruddy head, and made out that it had a face like a human being, and was talking with the boys and girls on the thwarts and was licking their hands. The boys and girls fondled them and gave them tit-bits and delicacies, as well as valuable goods such as silk for clothes, citron-wood for tables, purple for ornament and scarlet for dyeing.

[2] On seeing these I wanted to know what they represented, because I know that all sights seen in the spiritual world are correspondences, representing the spiritual effects of affection and the thought it produces. Then I was spoken to from heaven and told: 'You know yourself what the port and the ships represent, as well as the boys and girls on the thwarts; but you do not know what the turtles are. They represent,' they said, 'those of the clergy there who totally separate faith from charity and its good deeds, insisting to themselves that there is obviously no possibility of linking them, but the Holy Spirit by means of faith in God the Father for the sake of the Son's merit enters into a person and purifies him inwardly even as far as his own will, which they imagine as a sort of oval plane. When the working of the Holy Spirit approaches this plane, it twists aside around its left edge without touching it at all, so that the interior or upper part of the person's character is for God, and the exterior or lower part is for man. Thus nothing the person does appears in God's sight, neither good nor bad; the good does not, because this would be to acquire merit, and the bad does not because it is bad. Either of these, if it were presented to God's sight, would destroy the person, Since this is so, a person may will, think, speak and do whatever he pleases, so long as he takes precautions from a worldly point of view,'

[3] I asked whether they also held that one might think of God as not being omnipresent and omniscient. I was told from heaven that this too is allowed them, because in the case of one who has acquired faith and been purified and justified by it, God pays no attention to any thought or will on his part, but he still retains in the inward recess or higher region of his mind or character the faith which he had received by its activity, and that this activity may from time to time recur without the person's knowledge. 'These facts are represented by the small head which they draw back into the forepart of their bodies and also insert into the larger head when talking to laymen. For in speaking to them they do not use the small head, but the large one, the front of which has a kind of human face. Their talk with them is based on the Word, about love, charity, good deeds, the Ten Commandments, repentance; and they quote from the Word almost everything which is said there on these subjects. But then they insert the small head into the large one, which allows them inwardly to understand that these things are not to be done for God's sake or for salvation, but only for the sake of public or private advantage.

[4] 'But because they base their remarks on these subjects on the Word, especially in speaking with great charm and elegance of the Gospel, the working of the Holy Spirit and salvation, they seem to their hearers like handsome men endowed with wisdom beyond all others on the globe. This was why you saw them being given delicacies and valuable goods by the boys and girls sitting on the thwarts in the boats. So these are the people you saw represented as turtles. In your world they are hard to tell apart from others, except for the fact that they think they excel all others in wisdom, laughing at others, including those who hold similar views on faith, but are not privy to their secrets. They carry a seal with them in their clothing, by which they can make themselves known to others of their sort.'

[5] The person talking with me said: 'I shall not tell you their opinions on other matters to do with faith, such as the elect, free will, baptism and the Holy Supper. These are opinions that they do not divulge, though we in heaven know them. However, since this is the sort of people they are in the world, and after death no one is allowed to speak otherwise than he thinks, they are considered insane, because they are then unable to speak except for the mad ideas that fill their thoughts. So they are ejected from their communities, eventually being cast down into the pit of the abyss (mentioned in Revelation 9:2), becoming bodily spirits and looking like Egyptian mummies. A hard skin is drawn over the interiors of their minds, because in the world too they had set up a barrier there. The community they form in hell is adjacent to the one there composed of Machiavellians; they constantly visit one another and call themselves companions. But they leave them on account of their difference, in that they have some religious feeling about the act of justification by faith, while the Machiavellians have none.'

[6] After seeing them expelled from their communities and brought together ready to be cast down, I saw in the air a ship sailing under seven sails, and in it ships' officers and seamen dressed in purple with magnificent laurels on their hats. 'Here we are in heaven,' they shouted, 'we are purple-clad doctors, adorned with finer laurels than anyone else, because we are the leading wise men of all the clergy in Europe.' I wondered what this was, and I was told that they were pictures of pride and imaginary thoughts, known as fantasies, arising from those who previously appeared as turtles; now being cast out of their communities as insane, they were gathered into one group and were now standing in one place.

Then wishing to talk with them I approached the place where they were standing and greeted them. 'Are you,' I said, 'the people who separated people's internals from their externals, and the working of the Holy Spirit as in faith from the Spirit's co-operation with man outside of faith, thus separating God from man? Did you not by this take away not only charity itself and its deeds from faith, as many other doctors of the clergy do, but also faith itself in so far as it is displayed by man in the sight of God?

[7] But would you prefer me to talk to you on this subject by the light of reason, or by drawing upon Holy Scripture?' 'Speak first,' they said, 'by the light of reason.'

So I spoke and said: 'How can a person's internal and external be separated? Can anyone endowed with normal powers of perception fail to see, or fail to be capable of seeing, that all of a person's interiors extend into and are continued into his exteriors, reaching even to his outermost level so as to bring about their effects and perform what they want to do? Surely the internals exist for the sake of the externals, so that these may be where they end, and they may rest on them, so coming into being, very much as a column stands on its base. You can see that, if they were discontinuous and so not joined, the outermost layers would collapse and burst like a bubble in the air. Can anyone deny that the inward workings of God in a person number billions, all unknown to the person concerned; and what profit is it to know about them, so long as the outermost layers are known, the point at which he is in his thought and will together with God?

[8] 'Let us take an example to illustrate this. Surely no one is aware of the inward workings of his speech: how the lungs draw in air, which fills the vesicles, bronchi and lobes; how he expels the air into the trachea and there turns it into sound; how the sound is modified in the glottis by the help of the larynx, and how the tongue then articulates it, the lips completing the articulation, so that speech is produced. All those inward workings, of which the person is totally unaware, are for the sake of the end product, the person's ability to speak. Take away or separate one of those internal processes so that it is no longer continuous with the end product, and a person could no more talk than a block of wood.

[9] 'Let us take another example. The two hands form the extremities of the human body. But the internal parts which form a continuous link with them run from the head through the neck, then the chest, shoulder-blades, arms and elbows; and there are countless muscular tissues, countless rows of motor fibres, countless bundles of nerves and blood-vessels, and many joints of bones with their ligaments and membranes - is anyone aware of any of this? Yet it takes every single one of them to make the hands function. Suppose the internal parts twisted back to the left or the right around the wrist-joint and did not continue into the hands; would not the hand then fall away from the elbow and rot away like any lifeless part torn off? Or if you prefer the idea, it would be like what happens to the body when a person is beheaded. This is exactly what would happen to the human mind, together with its two kinds of life, the will and the understanding, if the Divine workings which have to do with faith and charity stopped mid-way, and did not extend without a break to man. To be sure, man then would be not merely an animal, but a rotten block of wood. Such conclusions are the product of reason.

[10] 'Now if you are willing to listen, the same things are in accordance with Holy Scripture. Does not the Lord say:

Remain in me and I in you. I am the vine and you are the branches. If someone remains in me and I in him, he bears much fruit, John 15:4-5.

Surely the fruits are the good deeds which the Lord does by means of man, and man does of himself under the Lord's guidance. The Lord also says that He stands at the door and knocks, and He goes in to anyone who opens the door, and dines with him and he with the Lord (Revelation 3:20). Does not the Lord give minas and talents for man to trade with and make a profit, and does He not give everlasting life in accordance with his profit (Matthew 25:14-30; Luke 19:13-26)? Or again, does He not give each man his pay in proportion to the work he does in the Lord's vineyard (Matthew 20:1-17)? These are but a few examples; pages could be filled with quotations from the Word showing that man should produce fruit like a tree, should act according to the commandments, love God and the neighbour, and much more besides.

[11] 'But I know that your own intelligence cannot have anything in common, regarded as it is essentially, with these teachings from the Word. Although you talk about them, your ideas pervert them. Nor can you help yourselves, because you take away from man everything that is God's as regards communication and the linking it produces. What is then left, but merely everything that has to do with public worship?'

Later on these people appeared to me in the light of heaven, which uncovers and makes visible what sort of person each one is. Then they did not appear as before in a ship sailing through the air as if in heaven, nor did the people in it have purple clothing and laurels around their heads. But they were in a sandy place, clothed in rags, with nets like fishermen's round their lower parts, through which their nakedness was visible. Then they were sent down to join a community which was adjacent to that of the Machiavellians.

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