'Ishmael' signifies the Lord's merely human rational and rationality separate from good.

In Genesis 25:12, 'Ishmael' signifies the spiritual church.

(Odkazy: Arcana Coelestia 1944)

1989. That 'Abram' means the Lord in that state and at that age is clear from what has been stated already about Abram. In the internal sense Abram represents the Lord, for when mentioned in the Word no other Abram is meant in heaven. People who have been born inside the Church and have heard of him from the Word do indeed know of Abram when they enter the next life, but because he is no different from any other human being and cannot be of any help to them, they are no longer interested in him. Furthermore they are informed that in the Word 'Abram' has been used to mean no one other than the Lord. Indeed angels, who possess heavenly ideas but form no image of any man with them, know nothing at all about Abram. Consequently when the Word is read by man and Abram is mentioned they perceive no one other than the Lord. And in the statement made here they perceive the Lord passing through that state and that age, for here Jehovah is talking to Abram, that is, to the Lord.