5612. 'Then I shall be sinning against you every day' means the good of the Church will not exist any longer. This is clear from the representation of Judah, who says this about himself, as the good of the Church, dealt with in 5583, 5603; from the meaning of 'sinning' as a separation, dealt with in 5229, 5474, thus the fact that it will not exist since that which is separated from someone does not exist with him any more; and from the meaning of 'every day' as for ever, thus not any longer. These words were spoken by Judah because the good of the Church has no existence without the intermediary, which is represented by 'Benjamin', between the internal and the external. For when either the good or the truth of the Church flows from the internal into the external it does so through the intermediary; consequently the existence of the intermediary is just as vital as the existence of the good of the Church, which is why Judah goes as surety for Benjamin. The non-existence of the good of the Church unless the intermediary is present is meant by these words spoken by Judah, while the non-existence of the truth of the Church is meant by those uttered by Reuben, 5542.

5542. 'He said, Make my two sons die' means that neither of the two kinds of faith will survive. This is clear from the meaning of Reuben's 'two sons' as both kinds of faith. For 'Reuben' represents faith in doctrine and in the understanding, while his 'sons' are the two kinds of teaching existing within the Church - teaching about what is true and teaching about what is good, that is, teaching about faith and teaching about charity. The thought that neither of these two kinds of faith or the Church will survive unless a joining of the intermediary represented by 'Benjamin' takes place is meant by 'make my two sons die if I do not bring back Benjamin to you'. In saying this Reuben certifies that the Church would be at an end unless the intermediary were present. But for the internal sense contained in those words Reuben would never have told his father to make his two sons die if he did not bring back Benjamin; for in telling him this Reuben would have been suggesting that he should subsequently wipe out an entire family. Such a course of action, being contrary to all that is right, would have been utterly wicked. But what the internal sense teaches explains why he spoke in the way he did.