4311. That in the internal historical sense by for I have seen God faces to faces, and my soul is delivered, is signified that He was present representatively, is evident from the signification of “seeing God faces to faces,” when these words are predicated of the state in which the posterity of Jacob were, as being that the Lord was present representatively; for to see God faces to faces in the external form and with the bodily sight, is not to see Him present (n. 4299). That He was not present as with those who are regenerate, and thereby are in spiritual love and faith, is manifest from what has been said of that nation (n. 4281, 4288, 4290, 4293)—that they were in external worship, and not at the same time in internal, or what is the same, in bodily and worldly, and not in spiritual and heavenly love. With such the Lord could never be present except representatively.

[2] What it is to be present representatively, must be briefly told. A man who is in bodily and worldly love and not at the same time in spiritual and heavenly love, has none but evil spirits with him, even when he is in a holy external; for good spirits cannot possibly be present with such a person, because they at once perceive in what kind of love a man is. There is a sphere which is exhaled from his interiors, which spirits perceive as manifestly as a man perceives by his sense of smell offensive and foul vapors floating around him in the air. That nation which is here treated of, was in such a state as to good and truth, or as to love and faith. In order, however, that they might serve as the representative of a church, it was miraculously provided by the Lord that when they were in a holy external, and were at the same time surrounded by evil spirits, the holy in which they were might yet be uplifted into heaven; and this by good spirits and angels not within but without them, for within them there was nothing but emptiness or uncleanness. Communication was therefore given not with the man himself, but with the holy itself in which they were when they fulfilled the statutes and precepts given them, which were all representative of spiritual and heavenly things of the Lord’s kingdom. This is signified by the Lord’s being present with that nation representatively. But the Lord is present in a very different way with those within the church who are in spiritual love and thence in faith. With these there are good spirits and angels not only in their external worship, but also at the same time in their internal; and therefore with them there exists a communication of heaven with themselves; for the Lord flows into them through heaven through their internals into their externals. To these the holy of worship is profitable in the other life, but not to the former.

[3] It is similar with priests and elders who preach holy things, and yet are in evil life and evil belief. With these there are not good, but evil spirits, even when they are in worship that appears holy in the external form. For it is the love of self and of the world, or a love for securing honors and acquiring gain and thereby fame, that fires them and presents an appearance of affection for what is holy, sometimes to such a degree that no simulation is perceived, nor is at the time believed by them to exist; when yet they are in the midst of evil spirits, who are then in a similar state, and who breathe upon them and into them. That evil spirits can be in such a state, and are so when they are in their externals, and are inflated with the love of self and of the world, has been given me to know by manifold experience, which of the Lord’s Divine mercy will be described hereafter at the end of the chapters. Such preachers have no communication with heaven in themselves; and yet those have who hear and receive the words from their mouth, if they are in a pious and holy internal; for it matters not from whom the voice of good and truth flows forth, provided their life is not manifestly wicked; for this life causes a scandal.

[4] That the nation descended from Jacob was of such a character (namely, that they were surrounded with evil spirits, and yet the Lord was present with them representatively), may be seen from many passages in the Word; for they were very far from worshiping Jehovah with the heart, and as soon as miracles were lacking, they immediately turned to other gods and became idolaters. This was a manifest proof that at heart they worshiped other gods and confessed Jehovah with the mouth only, and this merely for the reason that they might be the greatest and have preeminence over all the nations round about. That this people at heart worshiped an Egyptian idol, and only confessed Jehovah with the mouth on account of His miracles (with Aaron himself among them), is plainly evident from the golden calf which Aaron made for them, and this but a month after they had seen such great miracles on Mount Sinai, besides those which they had seen in Egypt (see Exodus 32). That Aaron also was of the same character is plainly stated at verses 2 to 5, (Exodus 32:2-5) and especially in (Exodus 32:35) verse 35. The same appears also from many other passages in Moses, in the book of the Judges, in the books of Samuel, and in the books of the Kings.

[5] That they were only in external worship and not in any internal worship, is evident also from the fact that they were forbidden to come near to Mount Sinai when the Law was promulgated, and were told that if they touched the mountain, they should surely die (Exodus 19:11-13; 20:16, 19). The reason was that their internal was unclean. It is also said in Moses:

That Jehovah dwelt with them in the midst of their uncleannesses (Leviticus 16:16).

The quality of that nation is evident also from the song of Moses (Deuteronomy 32:15-43), and from many passages in the Prophets. From all this it may be known that with that nation there was not any church, but only a representative of a church, and that the Lord was present with them only representatively.

[6] Compare also what has previously been stated in regard to them:

That with the posterity of Jacob there was a representative of a church, but not a church (n. 4281, 4288);

That the representative of a church was not instituted with them until after they had been altogether vastated as to a holy internal, and that they would otherwise have profaned holy things (n. 3398, 4289);

That when they remained in their statutes they could represent, but not when they turned aside from them (n. 3881 at the end);

That on this account they were kept strictly in rituals, and that they were driven thereto by external means (n. 3147, 4281);

That their worship was made external without internal in order that they might serve as a representative of a church (n. 4281);

That for this reason also the interior things of the church were not disclosed to them (n. 301-303vvv2, 2520, 3398, 3479, 3769);

That they were of such a nature that they could more than others be in a holy external without an internal (n. 4293);

That for this reason they have been preserved to this day (n. 3479);

And that their holy external does not affect them at all as to their souls (n. 3479).

3479. The Jews who lived before the coming of the Lord, as well as those who lived afterwards, had no other opinion concerning the rituals of their church than that Divine worship consisted solely in external things, and cared naught for what these represented and signified. For they did not know, and were not willing to know, that there was anything internal in worship and in the Word, thus that there was any life after death, nor consequently that there was any heaven, for they were altogether sensuous and corporeal; and inasmuch as they were in externals separate from things internal, relatively to these externals their worship was merely idolatrous, and therefore they were very prone to worship any gods whatsoever, provided only they were persuaded that such gods could cause them to prosper.

[2] But as that nation was of such a nature that they could be in a holy external, and thus could have holy rituals by which the heavenly things of the Lord’s kingdom were represented, and could have a holy veneration for Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and also for Moses and Aaron, and afterwards for David; by all of whom the Lord was represented; and especially could have a holy reverence for the Word, in which each and all things are representative and significative of Divine things, therefore in that nation a representative church was instituted. If however that nation had known internal things so far as to acknowledge them, they would have profaned them, and thereby when in a holy external would have been at the same time in a profane internal, so that there could have been through them no communication of representatives with heaven; and for this reason interior things were not disclosed to them, not even that the Lord was within, in order that He might save their souls.

[3] Inasmuch as the tribe of Judah was of this character more than the other tribes, and at this day just as in former times regard as holy the rituals which can be observed outside Jerusalem, and as they have a holy veneration for their fathers, especially as they regard the Word of the Old Testament as holy, and inasmuch as it was foreseen that Christians would almost reject this Word, and would likewise defile its internal things with things profane, therefore that nation has been preserved until this time, according to the words of the Lord in Matthew 24:34. It would have been otherwise if Christians, being acquainted with internal things, had also lived as internal men; in this case that nation, like other nations, would before many generations have been cut off.

[4] But the case with that nation is that their holy external or holy of worship cannot at all affect their internals, because these are unclean from the base love of self and from the unclean love of the world; and also from the idolatry of worshiping external things separate from internal; and thus because they have not anything of heaven in them, neither can they carry anything of heaven with them into the other life, except a few who live in mutual love, and thus do not despise others in comparison with themselves.