85. That no others than those described above are meant by the he-goats was made clear to me by experience in the spiritual world. In that world appear all things that are in the natural world, such as houses and palaces, paradises and gardens, and in them trees of every kind; likewise fields and cultivated lands, also plains and green pastures together with flocks and herds. All these resemble those upon our earth; nor is there any other difference than that the latter are from a natural, and the former from a spiritual, origin. I have often seen sheep and he-goats there, also combats between them, like the combat described in Daniel, chapter viii. I have seen he-goats with horns bent forwards and backwards, rushing with fury upon the sheep. I have seen some he-goats with two horns, and others with four, with which they vehemently struck at the sheep; and, when I looked to see what this meant, I saw some persons disputing together concerning faith united to charity, and concerning faith separated from charity. From this it plainly appeared that the present day belief in justification by faith alone, which considered in itself is faith disjoined from charity, is the he-goat, and that faith united with charity is the sheep.