3293. Two nations are in thy womb. That this signifies the natural as to interior and exterior good, that there is conception, is evident from the signification of “nations,” as being goods, especially the goods of the church (see n. 1159, 1258, 1260, 1416, 1849); and that here the goods which are in the natural are signified, is evident from the fact that Esau and Jacob, who were then in the womb, represent the Lord’s Divine natural, as will become very evident from what follows, where they are treated of. The natural, like the rational, consists of good and truth; the good in the natural is all that which is of natural affection, and is called delight; but the truth is all that which is of the memory, and is called memory-knowledge. These two must be in the natural for there to be any natural. By itself, memory-knowledge abstractedly from any delight which is of affection, is not anything; for the natural has its life from the delight within it; and from this derives its ability to know anything; whereas delight, which is the good of the natural, is something without memory-knowledge; but only such a vitality as infants have. In order therefore for the natural to be human it must consist of both, the one being perfected by the other; but it has its real life from good.

[2] As regards this good which is here treated of, it is twofold, interior and exterior; the interior good communicates with the interior man, that is, with the rational; while the exterior good communicates with the external man, that is, with the things of the body, and makes the life in the external senses, and also in the actions. Without this twofold communication, man cannot live either as to the reason or as to the body. It is the interior communication which abides with man after death, and then makes his natural life, for a spirit also has natural life, inasmuch as his spiritual life is terminated in the natural as in an ultimate plane; for immediately after death a man is not able to think spiritually, except from the things that belong to his natural. The exterior communication, however, is that which a man has while he lives in the body, but this ceases by the death of the body. All this shows what is signified by “two nations in the womb,” namely the natural as to interior and exterior good. “In the womb,” in the internal sense, signifies conception, therefore it is here said “that there is conception.”

1416. I will make thee into a great nation. That this signifies the kingdom in the heavens and on the earth, is evident from the signification of a “nation,” as being in the internal sense the celestial of love and the derivative good, thus all in the universe in whom is the celestial of love and of charity; and as in the internal sense the Lord is here treated of, there is meant all the celestial and all the derivative good, thus His kingdom, which is with those who are in love and charity. In the supreme sense the Lord is Himself the “great nation,” because He is the celestial itself, and good itself; for all the good of love and of charity is from Him alone; and therefore the Lord is His kingdom itself, that is, He is the all in all of His kingdom, as is also acknowledged by all the angels in heaven. Hence now it is evident that “I will make thee into a great nation,” signifies the Lord’s kingdom in the heavens and on earth.

[2] That in the internal sense, where the Lord and the celestial things of love are treated of, a “nation” signifies the Lord and all celestial things, is evident from the things adduced above concerning the signification of a “nation,” and of “nations” n. 1258,1259). This may also be further confirmed by the following passages. Concerning Abraham it is said:

Thy name shall not any more be called Abram, and thy name shall be Abraham, for the father of a multitude of nations have I given thee (Genesis 17:5).

The letter h in “Abraham” was taken from the name Jehovah, on account of his representation of Jehovah or the Lord. In like manner it is said of Sarai:

Thou shalt not call her name Sarai, but Sarah shall her name be. And I will bless her, and also give thee a son of her; thus I will bless her, and she shall become nations; kings of peoples shall be of her (Genesis 17:15-16); where “nations” denote the celestial things of love, and “kings of peoples” the spiritual things of faith thence derived, which belong to the Lord alone.

[3] Concerning Jacob in like manner:

Thy name shall no more be called Jacob, but Israel shall be thy name, and He called his name Israel: and God said, I am God the thunderer; increase and multiply; a nation and a congregation of nations shall be from thee, and kings shall go forth out of thy loins (Genesis 35:10-11); where “Israel” denotes the Lord, and that He Himself is “Israel” in the supreme sense, is well known to some; and when He is “Israel,” it is evident that “a nation” and “an assemblage of nations,” and “kings out of His loins,” are the celestial and the spiritual things of love, and therefore all who are in the celestial and the spiritual things of love. Concerning Ishmael, Abram’s son by Hagar, it is said:

The son of the handmaid I will make him into a nation, because he is thy seed (Genesis 21:13, 18).

What is represented by Ishmael will be seen in its place; the “seed” of Abram is love itself, and from this the term “nation” is used for those begotten of Ishmael.

[4] That a “nation” signifies the celestial things of love, is evident in Moses:

If hearing ye will hear My voice, and will keep My covenant, ye shall also be a peculiar treasure unto Me out of all peoples, and ye shall be unto Me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation (Exodus 19:5-6); where “a kingdom of priests,” which is the Lord’s kingdom in the heavens and on earth, being so named from the celestial things of love, is manifestly called “a holy nation;” whereas the Lord’s kingdom from His kingly function was named from the spiritual things of love, and is called “a holy people;” and for this reason “kings out of the loins,” in the passage quoted above, are spiritual things.

In Jeremiah:

If these statutes have departed from before Me, saith Jehovah, the seed of Israel also shall cease, that it be not a nation before Me all the days (Jeremiah 31:36);

“the seed of Israel” denotes the celestial of charity; and when this ceases, there is no longer a nation before the Lord.

[5] In Isaiah:

The people that walk in darkness have seen a great light; Thou hast multiplied the nation (Isaiah 9:2-3).

This is said of the church of the nations specifically; but in general of all who are in ignorance and live in charity; these are a “nation,” because they are of the Lord’s kingdom.

In David:

That I may see the good of Thy chosen; that I may be glad in the gladness of Thy nation, that I may glory in Thine inheritance (Psalms 106:5).

Here “nation” plainly denotes the Lord’s kingdom. As the signification of “nation” is the celestial of love and the derivative good, there originated, from a perception of this signification, the fact that the men of the Most Ancient Church were distinguished into households, families, and nations; and thereby they perceived the Lord’s kingdom, and consequently the celestial itself. From this Perceptive arose the Significative, and from this the Representative.