2960. 'What is that between me and you?' means that he gave his assent yet still wished to achieve it by himself, that is to say, to be prepared or reformed. This becomes clear from the sense of the letter when applied to the internal sense in which reformation is the subject. Above, Ephron said, 'The field I give to you, and the cave that is in it I give to you' verse 11, and by this was meant their will to prepare themselves as regards those things that constitute the Church and faith, that is, to reform themselves. For the first state of those who are being reformed is such, see 2946; but when they are more advanced in cognitions of truth or faith, they have entered their second state. Then they do indeed give assent, yet they still wish to achieve it by themselves. It is this state which is dealt with in this verse, while the third state when they believe that their reformation is effected by the Lord will be described next.

[2] The reason these people are such at first has been stated above in 2946. But when they become more advanced in cognitions of truth or faith they do indeed acknowledge that their reformation is effected by the Lord, yet they still wish to achieve it by themselves. One reason for this is that the cloud of ignorance is dispersed only gradually; another is that it takes time for truth to be corroborated; and another is that the perfection of good comes with the acquisition of cognitions of truth. Good itself that has truth implanted in it leads people not only to acknowledge but also to believe that reformation comes from the Lord. This state is the third, and a fourth follows it, that is to say, a state when they perceive that it comes from the Lord. Few however attain it during their lifetime since it is an angelic state; but those who are regenerate do attain it in the next life. From this it is evident that in the internal sense here the member of the spiritual Church is described - the nature of his state when he has yet to develop, the nature of it when he starts to develop, and at length when he has developed.

2954. 'I will give the price of the field, accept it from me' means redemption as regards the truths of the Church which come from the Lord. This is clear from the meaning of 'giving the silver' as redeeming by means of truth, dealt with above in 2937, for 'silver' means truth, 1551; from the meaning of 'the field' as the Church, and also the doctrine of truth, dealt with in 368, 2936; and from the meaning of 'accept it from me' as a willing response with those who belong to the Church. That response involves a belief that redemption comes from the Lord alone. As for what redemption is, it is the same as reformation and regeneration, and therefore being delivered from hell and being saved. The redemption, or reformation and salvation, of members of the spiritual Church is effected by means of truth, whereas that of members of the celestial Church is effected by means of good.

[2] The reasons why have been stated in various places already - that spiritual people possess no will at all for what is good, but instead have been provided with an ability to understand what good is. The understanding of what is good is primarily called truth, and indeed the truth of faith, while the willing of it and from this the doing of it is called good. Spiritual persons therefore, by means of an understanding of good, or what amounts to the same, by means of truth, are led on to a will for what is good, or what amounts to the same, to good. They are not led on to any will for what is good from anything that is their own, since all will for what is good has with them been destroyed, 895, 927, 2124. Instead they are led on to a new will which they receive from the Lord, 863, 875, 1023, 1043, 1044; and when they have received this new will they specifically are called the redeemed.