4311. That in the internal historical sense by for I have seen God faces to faces, and my soul is delivered, is signified that He was present representatively, is evident from the signification of “seeing God faces to faces,” when these words are predicated of the state in which the posterity of Jacob were, as being that the Lord was present representatively; for to see God faces to faces in the external form and with the bodily sight, is not to see Him present (n. 4299). That He was not present as with those who are regenerate, and thereby are in spiritual love and faith, is manifest from what has been said of that nation (n. 4281, 4288, 4290, 4293)—that they were in external worship, and not at the same time in internal, or what is the same, in bodily and worldly, and not in spiritual and heavenly love. With such the Lord could never be present except representatively.

[2] What it is to be present representatively, must be briefly told. A man who is in bodily and worldly love and not at the same time in spiritual and heavenly love, has none but evil spirits with him, even when he is in a holy external; for good spirits cannot possibly be present with such a person, because they at once perceive in what kind of love a man is. There is a sphere which is exhaled from his interiors, which spirits perceive as manifestly as a man perceives by his sense of smell offensive and foul vapors floating around him in the air. That nation which is here treated of, was in such a state as to good and truth, or as to love and faith. In order, however, that they might serve as the representative of a church, it was miraculously provided by the Lord that when they were in a holy external, and were at the same time surrounded by evil spirits, the holy in which they were might yet be uplifted into heaven; and this by good spirits and angels not within but without them, for within them there was nothing but emptiness or uncleanness. Communication was therefore given not with the man himself, but with the holy itself in which they were when they fulfilled the statutes and precepts given them, which were all representative of spiritual and heavenly things of the Lord’s kingdom. This is signified by the Lord’s being present with that nation representatively. But the Lord is present in a very different way with those within the church who are in spiritual love and thence in faith. With these there are good spirits and angels not only in their external worship, but also at the same time in their internal; and therefore with them there exists a communication of heaven with themselves; for the Lord flows into them through heaven through their internals into their externals. To these the holy of worship is profitable in the other life, but not to the former.

[3] It is similar with priests and elders who preach holy things, and yet are in evil life and evil belief. With these there are not good, but evil spirits, even when they are in worship that appears holy in the external form. For it is the love of self and of the world, or a love for securing honors and acquiring gain and thereby fame, that fires them and presents an appearance of affection for what is holy, sometimes to such a degree that no simulation is perceived, nor is at the time believed by them to exist; when yet they are in the midst of evil spirits, who are then in a similar state, and who breathe upon them and into them. That evil spirits can be in such a state, and are so when they are in their externals, and are inflated with the love of self and of the world, has been given me to know by manifold experience, which of the Lord’s Divine mercy will be described hereafter at the end of the chapters. Such preachers have no communication with heaven in themselves; and yet those have who hear and receive the words from their mouth, if they are in a pious and holy internal; for it matters not from whom the voice of good and truth flows forth, provided their life is not manifestly wicked; for this life causes a scandal.

[4] That the nation descended from Jacob was of such a character (namely, that they were surrounded with evil spirits, and yet the Lord was present with them representatively), may be seen from many passages in the Word; for they were very far from worshiping Jehovah with the heart, and as soon as miracles were lacking, they immediately turned to other gods and became idolaters. This was a manifest proof that at heart they worshiped other gods and confessed Jehovah with the mouth only, and this merely for the reason that they might be the greatest and have preeminence over all the nations round about. That this people at heart worshiped an Egyptian idol, and only confessed Jehovah with the mouth on account of His miracles (with Aaron himself among them), is plainly evident from the golden calf which Aaron made for them, and this but a month after they had seen such great miracles on Mount Sinai, besides those which they had seen in Egypt (see Exodus 32). That Aaron also was of the same character is plainly stated at verses 2 to 5, (Exodus 32:2-5) and especially in (Exodus 32:35) verse 35. The same appears also from many other passages in Moses, in the book of the Judges, in the books of Samuel, and in the books of the Kings.

[5] That they were only in external worship and not in any internal worship, is evident also from the fact that they were forbidden to come near to Mount Sinai when the Law was promulgated, and were told that if they touched the mountain, they should surely die (Exodus 19:11-13; 20:16, 19). The reason was that their internal was unclean. It is also said in Moses:

That Jehovah dwelt with them in the midst of their uncleannesses (Leviticus 16:16).

The quality of that nation is evident also from the song of Moses (Deuteronomy 32:15-43), and from many passages in the Prophets. From all this it may be known that with that nation there was not any church, but only a representative of a church, and that the Lord was present with them only representatively.

[6] Compare also what has previously been stated in regard to them:

That with the posterity of Jacob there was a representative of a church, but not a church (n. 4281, 4288);

That the representative of a church was not instituted with them until after they had been altogether vastated as to a holy internal, and that they would otherwise have profaned holy things (n. 3398, 4289);

That when they remained in their statutes they could represent, but not when they turned aside from them (n. 3881 at the end);

That on this account they were kept strictly in rituals, and that they were driven thereto by external means (n. 3147, 4281);

That their worship was made external without internal in order that they might serve as a representative of a church (n. 4281);

That for this reason also the interior things of the church were not disclosed to them (n. 301-303vvv2, 2520, 3398, 3479, 3769);

That they were of such a nature that they could more than others be in a holy external without an internal (n. 4293);

That for this reason they have been preserved to this day (n. 3479);

And that their holy external does not affect them at all as to their souls (n. 3479).

4288. These same words which have thus far been explained have regard also to the Jewish and Israelitish nation, which is named “Jacob” in the Word, as has been said and shown above (n. 4279). In that sense which is called the internal historical sense, by these words—“Let me go, for the dawn ariseth”—is signified that what is representative should depart from the posterity of Jacob, before they came into the representatives of the land of Canaan. It has been shown above what the character of that nation was, namely, that with them there was no internal worship, but only external; thus that the heavenly conjugial was separated from them, and therefore that no church could be instituted with them, but only the representative of a church (n. 4281).

[2] But be it known what a representative church is, and what the representative of a church. A representative church is when there is internal worship in external, and the representative of a church when there is no internal worship, but nevertheless there is external. In both there are nearly similar outward rituals, that is, similar statutes, similar laws, and similar precepts. But in the representative church the externals correspond with the internals, so as to make a one; whereas in the representative of a church there is no correspondence, because the externals are either devoid of internals, or are at variance with them. In a representative church celestial and spiritual love is the principal, but in the representative of a church bodily and worldly love is the principal. Celestial and spiritual love is the internal itself; but where there is no celestial and spiritual love, but only bodily and worldly love, the external is devoid of an internal. The Ancient Church, which was after the flood, was a representative church; but that which was instituted among the posterity of Jacob was only the representative of a church.

[3] To make this evident let the distinction be illustrated by examples. In the Representative Church Divine worship took place on mountains, because mountains signified celestial love, and in the supreme sense the the Lord, (n. 795, 1430, 2722, 4210); and when they were holding worship on mountains, they were in their holy state, because they were at the same time in celestial love. In the Representative Church Divine worship took place also in groves, because groves signified spiritual love, and in the supreme sense the Lord as to this love (n. 2722); and when they were holding worship in groves, they were in their holy state, because at the same time in spiritual love. In the Representative Church when they were holding Divine worship, they turned their faces to the rising of the sun, because by the rising sun was also signified celestial love (n. 101, 1529, 1530, 2441, 2495, 3636, 3643). And so when they looked at the moon they were in like manner penetrated with a certain holy reverence, because the moon signified spiritual love (n. 1529-1531, 2495, 4060). It was similar when they looked at the starry heaven, because this signified the angelic heaven or the Lord’s kingdom. In the Representative Church they had tents or tabernacles, and Divine worship in them, and this holy; because tents or tabernacles signified the holy of love and worship (n. 414, 1102, 2145, 2152, 3312); and so in innumerable other things.

[4] In the representative of a church there was indeed in the beginning a like Divine worship upon mountains, and also in groves, and they also turned their faces toward the rising of the sun, and looked at the moon and the stars, and similarly held worship in tents or tabernacles. But as they were in external worship without internal, or in bodily and worldly love, and not in celestial and spiritual love, and thus worshiped the mountains and groves themselves, and the sun, moon, and stars, as also their tents or tabernacles, and thus made the rituals idolatrous which in the Ancient Church were holy, they were therefore restricted to what was common to all, namely, to the mountain where Jerusalem was, and at last where Zion was, and to the rising of the sun as seen thence and from the temple, and also to a tent in common, which was called the tent of meeting, and finally to the ark in the temple; and this to the intent that a representative of a church might exist when they were in a holy external; as otherwise they would have profaned holy things.

[5] From this it is evident what the distinction is between a representative church and a representative of a church; in general, that they who were of the representative church communicated with the three heavens as to their interiors, to which these external things served as a plane; but they who were in the representative of a church did not communicate with the heavens as to their interiors; but still the external things in which they were kept could serve as a plane, and this miraculously of the Lord’s providence, to the intent that something of communication might exist between heaven and man, by means of some semblance of a church; for without the communication of heaven with man through something of a church, the human race would perish. What the correspondence of internal things is, cannot be told in few words, but will of the Lord’s Divine mercy be told in the following pages.